PWM idle for Bosch valve 0 280 140 516

swedefiend · Post by **swedefiend** » Tue Aug 23, 2005 5:20 pm

Hi guys, finally got around to wiring up my two wire motor and upgrading firmware to 024s9.

Everything seems to be working, but I am having some difficulty with the settings for the idle control.

I measured the frequency and %DC from a car today at work using the same valve.

I got 97.66 HZ and a constant DC of 32.4%

I am assuming that the unwavering DC was due to the extremely high temps we had today. Seems like ~30ish this valve should almost be closed.

edit:// This is because the valve is designed to fall back open when the DC falls to zero (the manual says for "limp home mode".

I didn't have time to experiment more with turning the AC off and on, clamping off the supply hose for the motor, etc...

I simply would like to duplicate the frequency with my board and then proceed with the tuning from there.

I have done extensive searching and know that I must modify the .s19 for my controller. I believe that I can handle this, but I am uncertain as to what exactly needs to be modified to produce this (or a relatively similar - i.e. 100 HZ) frequency.

Can someone help me out?

TIA

Oh yeah, a few more questions:

For closed loop - what do the following mean?

"kickup DC"
"Dashpot DC"
"minimum DC"

That's all I promise.

Thanks

swedefiend · Post by **swedefiend** » Tue Aug 23, 2005 10:46 pm

Okay, did some more reading and I believe I read that the current code version is running at 100 HZ frequency as designed. Am I correct in this?

If so, can someone please help me think through the operation of this valve.

I think that the car I measured today was probably running at the lowest duty cycle acceptable for proper valve operation. If the required DC to "close" close the valve is 30%, then should this be my min DC? Or will I have to hack the code somewhere to make the min %DC ~30?

Also, I noticed that when changing the valves operating parameters, it was necessary for me to restart the controller after I changed values in order to get the desired idle.

Two more Q's:
When you input the fast idle temp, is that the temp below which the valve is active? And for the slow idle temp, is it the same?

Thanks for any help guys.

Keithg · Post by **Keithg** » Wed Aug 24, 2005 4:19 am

yes, in my Bosch LH car it ran at 100 HZ. Yes, it closes at 25<idleDC<30. Yes, you should use 27 hz as your minDC. I never noticed the need to restart it. I also noted that it will regulate idle better if it is run at 50 hz so that the steps are 0.5% DC instead of 1%. You will need to double all DC values in on the config pages to do this. I have hacked the current code to work well with this AIC. You need to use the latest as James fixed a bug in the PWM controller portion of the code that will accept and properly use frequencies that are lower than 100 HZ.

keithmac · Post by **keithmac** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 3:37 pm

Sorry to dig this back up from the dead

I`ve just installed my 2 pin Bosch idle valve, just a quesation for you Keith. You say run the valve at 50hz and double up the DC, so does that mean the useable range is in the 60 to 80 range?

Also by altering the config I assume you just mean what you actually input into the Megatune and not editiing any ini files?

Cheers for any pointers

Keithg · Post by **Keithg** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 8:12 pm

please keep digging it up... I'd love to have a little help with this development

It seems that there are not too many interested in CL idle...

yes, I put the idle freq value at 200 which means 50hz.
Yes, it does double up on the values 40% is 80 because it is actually in 0.5 hz increments, so 80/2...

Let me know how it goes

KeithG

keithmac · Post by **keithmac** » Thu Nov 24, 2005 3:40 am

Thanks for the help, a good wamup/ idle with the power steering active will be the icing on the cake for me

, will have play with the settings tonight.

So valve closed with the 200 setting will be around 60, may aim for 35 and adjust the trottle stop top get me a good steady hot idle at 1000 rpm and go from there.

I was in the 20`s before so this may have been actually shitting the valve, not good!

Keithg · Post by **Keithg** » Thu Nov 24, 2005 6:48 am

well, the valve is closed at ~25% (50counts at 50 hz...). I would suggest a target DC at idle of 40 at warm engine and 70F MAT. I run it at 40-43% at these points. With heat soak, it can get to 60% (120 counts) and on a cold day, it can be down to 32%. It is not that cold, yet, so We will have to see 'how low it goes'. I tried to jokey the throttle plate to get less AIC% and ran into situations where it would not regulate because it would go to min DC and idle speed would still be above target.

Good luck,

KeithG

keithmac · Post by **keithmac** » Fri Nov 25, 2005 2:02 am

Thanks again, read up on the specs in the VW G60 tech pdf and the valve is supplied with 400ma to 1200ma depending on load, so I`ll set hot idle at 1000 with the valve at 33% and go from there.

Can finally rip out the digi1 loom/ecu

keithmac · Post by **keithmac** » Fri Nov 25, 2005 8:01 am

Well had a go today with poor results really..

In idle control continued the Min Freqency dosn`t seem top work at all? and all the fast/slow idle rpm doesn`t seem to make any difference?

All I can think of doing is set the base idle with the screw and just use the 2 kPa corrected minimums to offset the use of the PAS and cooant fan?

Keithg · Post by **Keithg** » Fri Nov 25, 2005 8:31 am

Keith

Which version of the code are you running? I am working with 025x1 today with a revised idle code. If this last edit works, I could send you a copy and you could try it out.

In the meantime, try open loop to see what values work to regulate idle speed (at least at the temps you are seeing today). It will get you going with figuring out what DC values you need to use. let me know how it goes.

KeithG
(another Keith)

AIM handle KeithSPG

Keithg · Post by **Keithg** » Fri Nov 25, 2005 8:37 am

Keith

Which version of the code are you running? I am working with 025x1 today with a revised idle code. If this last edit works, I could send you a copy and you could try it out.

In the meantime, try open loop to see what values work to regulate idle speed (at least at the temps you are seeing today). It will get you going with figuring out what DC values you need to use. let me know how it goes.

KeithG
(another Keith)

AIM handle KeithSPG

keithmac · Post by **keithmac** » Fri Nov 25, 2005 8:49 am

Hello, I`m running 027a extra code. I started off by running open loop on the hot engine and I got values in the 30`s (at freq 100), also tried with freq 200 (50hz).

Had a good hour on it and didn`t get very far, just had another go and set the hot idle with the stop, ISV at 25 (on 100 feq), set 75kpa for PAS - anti stall and it didn`t seem too bad. Tried altering the ignition evens per step and didn`t seem to make a lot of difference.

Does the code actually target the rpms you put in for fast and slow idle?

Only reason I upgraded to 027a was for the idle control so I`d love to try your code, I`ll pm you my e-mail addy

monstermonte · Post by **monstermonte** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 12:39 pm

Hi All, I have just removed (this morning)the mod to run the PWM bosch valve as i found this on the forum http://www.tuneparts.co.uk/iscv.htm it shows it as a stepper motor. Now it is set to run the IAC as a stepper motor. This is now where it gets confusing, this thread now is saying it's a PWM!! Can you help?? Regards, Paul

Keithg · Post by **Keithg** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:54 pm

The picture in the link shows a stepper motor type on the left and a PWM type on the right. Which one do you have? the 516 valve is a PWM 2 wire type and is pretty well described in this thread. The current 029y4 and HR10g will drive this valve nicely.

KeithG

monstermonte · Post by **monstermonte** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 3:27 pm

Hi Keith, I have the one one the right and, as luck would have it i've just returned the MS back to PWM status with Q4 mods etc. Mainly done this as i've spent 3months fitting / making loom and thought after all that I'll find (if it wasn't already!) a PWM valve So, your reply has the problem solved!!! TOP MAN! BTW do you have the settings for this valve? All the best and once again thanks for the reply!! Regards, Paul

Keithg · Post by **Keithg** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 5:15 pm

I have what works for me. My settings. Read and understand the F1 help. ANy questions, please post here.

http://ys3al35l.googlepages.com/idle_1.jpg
http://ys3al35l.googlepages.com/idle_2.jpg

Chips60bug · Post by **Chips60bug** » Sat Aug 09, 2008 3:21 pm

Hi there. I picked up a Bosch idle valve (0 280 140 551) today for my MS application. I am running MS2 PCB 3.0. I am still in the construction stages so this is not yet a running vehicle. According to step 62 in the assembly instructions I am supposed to put a diode across the idle valve itself. How do I do this? Am I supposed to take the valve apart? Does the diode touch both connections on the valve? Thanks! Chip

Keithg · Post by **Keithg** » Sat Aug 09, 2008 6:49 pm

Put the diode either a) in the harness near the idle valve or b) on the board between the PWM output to the valve and the 12V input pin on the board. In both my V3 board constructions. Remove Q20, Remove D8, Short R39. I put my freewheeling diode on the bottom of the board between C hole of D8 the and pin 28 of the DB37 (+12 Raw).

KeithG

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PWM idle for Bosch valve 0 280 140 516

PWM idle for Bosch valve 0 280 140 516

Re: PWM idle for Bosch valve 0 280 140 516

Re: PWM idle for Bosch valve 0 280 140 516

Re: PWM idle for Bosch valve 0 280 140 516

Re: PWM idle for Bosch valve 0 280 140 516

Re: PWM idle for Bosch valve 0 280 140 516

Re: PWM idle for Bosch valve 0 280 140 516