Help with initial setup

styxplo · Post by **styxplo** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 11:59 am

I have a megasquirt_II with the version 3 board. Im am using TunerStudioMs. I believe I have the basic setup correct as far as the initial PWM setup for my low impedence injectors, REQ-Fuel, and the other basics. In the configuring VE table sections it says to use the generate table 'Tables/VE Tables/Tools'. Can't seem to find this option?? My table is already populated with numbers and I'm not sure where they were computed from. I've read that you have to enter in peak horsepower and peak torque, but I haven't entered torque in anywhere. There was a link to a VE table calculator, but when I used it it was an 8x8 populated with all 1's. I have also found mention of using MSTweakl3000, but the link is broke. Any help would be appreciated.

kjones6039 · Post by **kjones6039** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 3:26 pm

Let's start with some basics.

Engine?
Firmware version?
TS version?
Boosted or N/A?
Post your msq

Ken

styxplo · Post by **styxplo** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 7:24 pm

Due to what I discovered tonight this post now probably belongs elsewhere, but since I started it here and you responded.......Ok the background on this is I built and tested this a while ago. I built a stim from extra parts I had and tested everything with the igniton trigger tied to my then running cabureted Bronco II. It has the Ford duraspark conversion pulled from an early mustang. It is a naturally aspirated ford 171 (2.8L) v6. Due to life it sat uninstalled in my basement for months. I finally got around to installing it. I unsoldered the connector from my stim and soldered it according to the wiring diagram for the version 3 board which I have (just like the manual says?). I solderd the (-) side of the coil to pin 2 as it was in the diagram. On my initial start last nite I got nothing. I noticed that I had no crank signal. Hmmmmm?? I looked at the other wiring diagram and noticed it was landed on pin 24. I looked at my connector and sure enough there was solder on that pin meaning I previously had something solderd there. I moved the (-) to that terminal and turned the engine over and sure enough I had a tach signal. After several minutes of no start, not even a sign of ignitoin. I figured it was flooded and called it a night. Tonight after work I went out and first thing I did was pull the injector fuses and use a little squirt of ether to see if there was any sign of life. Nothing. I drove this into my garage a little over 2 weeks ago just fine. I am leaning now towards and igniton problem. So I hook up a timing lite to old number 1. When it did flash I was right around the base timing of 10 btc. (off some but I was cranking not idling) I did notice it has a very intermittent flash. I hooked it up at my coil and it was still very intermitent. I also noticed that my coil was very warm, even hot, but I could put my hand on it. Not sure what that means or if it is normal?

What exactly does pin 2 do?

Could this have damaged my ignition system?

Am I right in thinking that the pickup in the distributor probably wasn't damaged and is somewhat isolated from damage through my duraspark ignition box. If I remember correctly the only thing in a distrubtor signal wise is some type of coil that induces a signal when some thing passes by it?

Thanks Mark

kjones6039 · Post by **kjones6039** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 9:35 pm

Mark,

Ford duraspark

Bad news is, I have no experience with Duraspark, but I have some comments regardless
.

I solderd the (-) side of the coil to pin 2 as it was in the diagram.

Can you provide a link to that diagram? (the one that says to connect coil- to a sensor ground (ie Pin 2)?

I am leaning now towards and igniton problem.

Sounds reasonable, even likely!

I also noticed that my coil was very warm, even hot, but I could put my hand on it. Not sure what that means or if it is normal?

Normal? Maybe, maybe not. The fact is, that the coil may well be damaged by having been connected to ground for a significant period of time.

What exactly does pin 2 do?

It is a ground (generally used by sensors)!

Could this have damaged my ignition system?

Not outside the realm of possibility.

Am I right in thinking that the pickup in the distributor probably wasn't damaged and is somewhat isolated from damage through my duraspark ignition box.

That question will be better answered by one of the guys who know Duraspark. (sorry)

Ken

styxplo · Post by **styxplo** » Tue Feb 25, 2014 4:46 am

Here is the link to the V3 wiring diagram http://www.megamanual.com/ms2/V3assemble.htm#ew
Looking at it now Im going to guess this is the wiring if meagsquirt is firing the coil.

By the way Im using Tunerstudio MS lite v2.08
I'm not sure which is my firmware, but megasquirt-II _2920.ini
Monitor_v2.920.abs.s19

Also in order to post my msq Im guessing I just export it somehow?

I'm sure I will be back to working on the tune in the near future

styxplo · Post by **styxplo** » Tue Feb 25, 2014 6:28 am

Upon reading it shows how the VR circuit is wired up in the diagram

kjones6039 · Post by **kjones6039** » Tue Feb 25, 2014 10:59 am

styxplo wrote:Upon reading it shows how the VR circuit is wired up in the diagram

That is correct. Pin 24 is the trigger input. The internal jumpers then determine the routing of the trigger to the appropriate circuits (ie. opto, vr, etc.) based on the type of trigger you are using.

The external wiring schematic that I prefer can be found here.

Also in order to post my msq Im guessing I just export it somehow?

When you open the Reply window, click the Upload attachment tab at the bottom of the window. You can then browse for the file you wish to post, which is normally found in your TunerStudio projects folder.

Hope that helps......

Ken

styxplo · Post by **styxplo** » Tue Feb 25, 2014 1:03 pm

I think that diagram is misleading because it states under the picture Tach/Crank position input (Hall/Vr/Coil-). I thought the picture was a coil. I was just goin from the diagram. If you hook up the coil this way apparently it can cause some problems. Just thinking out loud.

kjones6039 · Post by **kjones6039** » Tue Feb 25, 2014 8:10 pm

I will continue to attempt to help you as best I can, but I respectfully disagree.

The gray wire (same color as in the loom) clearly goes to pin 24 (the tach-in pin, in all version 3 boards). The ground wire is black (also the same color as the loom) as are all other grounds in that diagram (or any others in the various manuals).

Ken

trakkies · Post by **trakkies** » Wed Feb 26, 2014 1:10 am

One thing I find wrong with that diagram is it doesn't show power to the wideband controller.

kjones6039 · Post by **kjones6039** » Wed Feb 26, 2014 1:51 am

trakkies wrote:One thing I find wrong with that diagram is it doesn't show power to the wideband controller.

Good morning Dave.....
You are correct as usual!

styxplo · Post by **styxplo** » Thu Feb 27, 2014 9:40 am

I'm not trying to be argumentative and I do appreciate your help.

Im not sure if we are referring to the same drawing. The drawing I linked shows a white wire labled (+) connected to what I thought was the coil (and is labled tach/crank position input (hall/VR/coil-) going to pin 24. It shows a green wire labeled (-) going to pin 2. I didn't connect my (+) side of my coil to pin 24 as the drawing shows because I knew it was already hot with ignition switch in run or crank. I also didn't use the loom ( which I'm going to assume is a wiring loom made specifically for megasquirt.) If I look at the wiring diagram for the version 2.2 main board located in the mega manual under the Sensors and Wiring tab it shows a clear picture of a coil with the (-) side of the coil wired to pin 24 and nothing on the (+) side. All that aside.... I did get it fired up. It must of fried my igniton control module when I hooked it up wrong. My required fuel calculated out to 8.5 mSecs. Im still playing with the crank after start and warm up. It seems like it needs to be alot richer then the intial settings I started with. It takes prob 20 secs to finally start with the cold start cranking set at 11. I have the next few days of and will mess with these. Once I got it warmed up I had to increase the VE table at idle (roughly 900 RPM and close 46 to 51 on the map.) My initial number in this area were in the high 30" (37-39) To get the lowest map reading I had to go up to 55-60. This was leading me to believe that perhaps my REQ-Fuel might be off???? I will psot my msq today when I get to the garage. Thanks

styxplo · Post by **styxplo** » Thu Feb 27, 2014 9:44 am

One more thing. With the carbuertor I had to add resistors in series with the choke heatrer to slow down the openeing because it took forever to wamr up and if the choke opened to fast it would stall out.

styxplo · Post by **styxplo** » Thu Feb 27, 2014 10:40 am

Here is my MSQ

DonTZ125 · Post by **DonTZ125** » Thu Feb 27, 2014 11:36 am

styxplo wrote:The drawing I linked shows a white wire labled (+) connected to what I thought was the coil (and is labled tach/crank position input (hall/VR/coil-) going to pin 24. It shows a green wire labeled (-) going to pin 2. I didn't connect my (+) side of my coil to pin 24 as the drawing shows because I knew it was already hot with ignition switch in run or crank.

Ok - there's the confusion! The little cylinder shown in the diagram at the end of the green and white wires is supposed to represent your VR or Hall crank position sensor, a little device that reads a toothed wheel. The 'coil -ve' note there DOES refer to your ignition coil, but ONLY when ignition is being controlled by some other outside unit - the OEM distributor mechanism, or some other riggins. If you are trying to control the ignition with the MS, you can't use the spark from ignition coil as a signal for when you want the spark to fire!

Your msq shows 0 teeth, suggesting a fuel-only arrangement. If you're running off coil -ve, then you should be using the OPTO circuit, as modified by the notes in the assembly instructions or on the schematic.

garrymc · Post by **garrymc** » Fri Feb 28, 2014 9:49 am

How hard would it be to go EDIS with your v6?

styxplo · Post by **styxplo** » Fri Feb 28, 2014 8:34 pm

I posted this somewhere else then noticed the last post was from 2010 so I posted it here to thinking I might get a little more traffic. Sorry for the double post. First off the tuning manual states to use megatweek3000, I'm starting to think this is no longer valid?? I am trying to use MegaLogViewer MS Lite ver 3.4.04, but both links to the manual in this forum are broken. I tried the help option and it brought me to the EFI analyst website for the analyzer. I followed the instructions there. When I open my current tune (.msq file) in MegaLogViewer under the VE section I am able to view it. When I try to run VE analyzer it say the following fields are required for VE analyzer to work best: RPM, Gego, AFR, Load. Also to improve resluts please log these additional fields. CLT. I click on the OK box and nothing happens?? I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong.

Also is it normal to be real rich at idle?? I tuned my idle for the lowest MAP reading and it wound up being pretty rich. compared to the other bins around my idle. The O2 reads .80 V at idle.

Again thank you for the help.

styxplo · Post by **styxplo** » Fri Feb 28, 2014 8:41 pm

As for the ignition problems I just noticed the 2 responses. I am triggering off the (-) side of the coil. I am using the ford Duraspark ignition system. I did install the opto isolater circuit and I've actually got that issue pretty much hashed out. Thanks for the help. As for the ford EDIS ignition I'm not sure. Originally this truck had a computer controlled carburetor. It was absolute junk. It was the precursor to EFI. It did have a computer controlled igniton system, but I replaced the carb with a small Holley and used the ignition system out of a 70's Pinto. It ran really well except for big inclines it would flood and stall. Not very fun rolling backwards down a huge hill with no engine power for brakes or steering. This is why I am convertint it to EFI

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